Announcements: Cutting Costs (2024) » January 2024 Copyfraud Attack » Finding Universes to Join (and making yours more visible!) » Guide To Universes On RPG » Member Shoutout Thread » Starter Locations & Prompts for Newcomers » RPG Chat — the official app » Frequently Asked Questions » Suggestions & Requests: THE MASTER THREAD »

Latest Discussions: With Chat currently offline... An alternative » Adapa Adapa's for adapa » To the Rich Men North of Richmond » Shake Senora » Good Morning RPG! » Ramblings of a Madman: American History Unkempt » Site Revitalization » Map Making Resources » Lost Poetry » Wishes » Ring of Invisibility » Seeking Roleplayer for Rumple/Mr. Gold from Once Upon a Time » Some political parody for these trying times » What dinosaur are you? » So, I have an Etsy » Train Poetry I » Joker » D&D Alignment Chart: How To Get A Theorem Named After You » Dungeon23 : Creative Challenge » Returning User - Is it dead? »

Players Wanted: Looking for a long term partner! » JoJo or Mha roleplay » Seeking long-term rp partners for MxM » [MxF] Ruining Beauty / Beauty x Bastard » Minecraft Rp Help Wanted » CALL FOR WITNESSES: The Public v Zosimos » Social Immortal: A Vampire Only Soiree [The Multiverse] » XENOMORPH EDM TOUR Feat. Synthe Gridd: Get Your Tickets! » Aishna: Tower of Desire » Looking for fellow RPGers/Characters » looking for a RP partner (ABO/BL) » Looking for a long term roleplay partner » Explore the World of Boruto with Our Roleplaying Group on FB » More Jedi, Sith, and Imperials needed! » Role-player's Wanted » OSR Armchair Warrior looking for Kin » Friday the 13th Fun, Anyone? » Writers Wanted! » Long term partner to play an older male wanted » DEAD! »

Nihilism

a topic in Discussion & Debate, a part of the RPG forum.

Moderators: dealing with it, Ambassadors

Talk about philosophy, politics, news & current events, or any other subject you're interested in!

Nihilism

Tips: 2.00 INK Postby dealing with it on Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:57 pm

What are your thoughts on nihilism? Is objective morality real? Do humans have a purpose? Is absolute knowledge a fever dream?

Tip jar: the author of this post has received 2.00 INK in return for their work.

User avatar
dealing with it
Groundskeeper
Groundskeeper
Member for 13 years
Contributor Conversation Starter Author Conversationalist Friendly Beginnings Donated! Greeter Beta Tester Tipworthy Concierge Lifegiver Person of Interest

Re: Nihilism

Tips: 9.50 INK Postby lostamongtrees on Fri Jul 09, 2021 10:29 am

dealing with it wrote:What are your thoughts on nihilism?


Oof, that's a doozie of a question. I think nihilism is something humans are drawn to as they become more aware of that which they don't control and how it impacts their life in uncontrollable ways. I consider nihilism to be a succumbing to the part of existence which is powerless, and the surrendering of personal power in regards to conscious impact.

This is not to say the nihilistic individual is unable to achieve impact, but it's passive in nature from my observances unless the opportunity presents itself which is adverse the known reality of "I am powerless". It is in these moments the nihilist individual, I firmly believe, synthesizes into an optimist - even if only circumstantially.

To fully commit any one human to full nihilism would be to deny them the free will of the ability to change their mind. I don't think nihilism can ever damper that.

dealing with it wrote:Is objective morality real?


Morality is a form of judgement, a set of principals. Any individual can assume morality - even animals assume morality with traditions usually surrounding life and suffering. Whales assist a newly birthed member of their pod find their first breath of air, while dolphin pods kill for sport.

Objective morality is very real - the more parts to the whole, the more that morality gets muddied with the input of the parts. If objective morality has to be enforced, meaning it isn't consensus, is it truly objective, and is it truly moral? The moment where one assumes a moral principle to be objective, is the same moment where it must also be acknowledged and further assumed by all witnessing and impacted parties. Killing is wrong, most agree, but then many will bring up the circumstance of- and depending on your conditioning or crossover moralities (from other belief structures) you may think differently than your neighbor in regards to where killing is right.

I don't think truly objective morality can be achieved until we can ensure all have the same conditioning (within a spectrum) in regards to experiencing morality, which would be assuming pure globalism - which, given the nature of humans, I don't think is objectively moral as it would require either many to be forced to participate, or the absolute exclusion of many; the latter which I'd assume to be more morally sound than the former.

dealing with it wrote:Do humans have a purpose?


It depends on the context and time relation.
I have a purpose at my job, and I have a purpose with my words here. Each task I execute has a purpose, and may contribute to the execution of a greater purpose. Who is to choose which task executed as the defining moment of my existence? This would require belief in an entity that validates.

This leads into the morality of a validation party, and the ethics of self validation based on morality.

If morality is truly objective, self validation can flourish and purpose constantly acknowledged and realized.

If self validation is based on personal morality vs subscription to an objective morality, purpose can still be acknowledged and realized, but is at risk of being invalidated by a differing moral structure of any level of objectivity.

"You create your own reality" L Ron Hubbard said. I believe the definition of purpose is manifested on a personal level within each human, contingent upon which moral structure they subscribe to and how much need for external validation is present in such a structure.

dealing with it wrote:Is absolute knowledge a fever dream?


Absolute knowledge is a conundrum. To acknowledge knowledge as something with an absolute would be to acknowledge the finite limits of our Universe. I don't think we, as humans, have the capacity to collect and store all of the knowledge in this iteration of the universe - especially considering how much of it has been legitimately lost to time & the neglect of humans.

It's a fever dream until we can achieve a form of time travel that doesn't muck everything up. If we can walk through time as mere observers, the world washing around us, even then we may never capture the infinity of knowledge present in the past: we won't be able to pick their minds. There is a never-ending well of the knowing-stuff within each of us and we won't have a ladle.

Going forward, so long as we stick all the knowledge and all the knowing somewhere immutable, and fully accessible by every human, as well as with the structure to provide such knowledge (hey, Google- can you go back to being this?), "absolute knowledge" would only be a fever dream for those unwilling to put in the work to either memorize the everything (bad idea) or continue contributing any and all things to the greater compendium of knowledge...

..And who knows when that process will ever end? What happens if we reach the Restaurant at the End of the Universe, and we meet a whole new species? Then what? We missed something. Well, maybe we won't miss it the next iteration of man in this strange reality.
tag me in the chat!

Image
Become a Cartographer
Chart the stars of
The Multiverse with us!

The Hunt
Do you have what it takes
to become a Hunter?

"Across the nations the stories spread like spiderweb laid upon spiderweb, and men and women planned the future, believing they knew truth.
They planned, and the Pattern absorbed their plans, weaving toward the future foretold."

- Robert Jordan

Tip jar: the author of this post has received 9.50 INK in return for their work.

User avatar
lostamongtrees
Ambassador
Ambassador
Member for 13 years
Promethean Conversation Starter Author Inspiration World Builder Conversationalist Novelist Arc Warden Party Starter Person of Interest Group Theory Helmsman Builder Streamwatcher Beta Tester Storyteller Maiden Voyager Greeter Concierge Friendly Beginnings Recruiter Tipworthy Cult Leader Hordemaster Historian Lifegiver Visual Appeal Donated! Salesman Property Buyer Contributor Giver Giver

Re: Nihilism

Tips: 0.00 INK Postby dealing with it on Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:20 pm

lostamongtrees wrote:To fully commit any one human to full nihilism would be to deny them the free will of the ability to change their mind.

I think that free will is the ability to choose, based on reasons (such as a list of pros and cons), which option to take. Someone who cannot formulate reasons has no free will. Can a nihilist weigh the options, or does she necessarily have no goals?

lostamongtrees wrote:I don't think truly objective morality can be achieved until we can ensure all have the same conditioning (within a spectrum) in regards to experiencing morality

How is this different than purely subjective morality? We clearly can't all have the same nature and nurture, so objective morality seems to be impossible. On the other hand, if morality is somehow baked into reality, and we are approximating it with our various conditionings, how can we recognize it?

lostamongtrees wrote:I have a purpose at my job, and I have a purpose with my words here. Each task I execute has a purpose, and may contribute to the execution of a greater purpose. Who is to choose which task executed as the defining moment of my existence?

So purpose is a distinct goal, which we achieve with the tools at hand. If we look at Nietzsche, we see someone who completely rejects any higher, universal goal for humankind. It may as well be "42". Or, if you prefer Monty Python: "Try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations".

"What is the purpose of life?" is a set-up for a joke, nothing more.

lostamongtrees wrote:To acknowledge knowledge as something with an absolute would be to acknowledge the finite limits of our Universe. I don't think we, as humans, have the capacity to collect and store all of the knowledge in this iteration of the universe - especially considering how much of it has been legitimately lost to time & the neglect of humans.

What about such forms as knowledge as logic and mathematics?
Is "A" self-identical with itself (A=A)?
Is a contradiction always false?
Must a logical statement be either true or false, but not both or neither?
In base 10, does the sum of 2 and 3 always equal 5?
Speaking of all of reality altogether, are we sure that reality is not nothing whatsoever?
Does the mere appearance of of the cogito prove the existence of the cogito?

There seems to be a plurality, indeed a near infinite number, of claims that can be said to be absolutely true, and both knowable and known absolutely.

Do we need to know all true things to know enough? It doesn't seem that we need to memorize the lot of it to be able to say quite a lot about it. Indeed, we can use a small handful to derive complex logical systems that we can then use to analyze the truth-values of countless logical statements. It looks explosive.

Tip jar: the author of this post has received 0.00 INK in return for their work.

User avatar
dealing with it
Groundskeeper
Groundskeeper
Member for 13 years
Contributor Conversation Starter Author Conversationalist Friendly Beginnings Donated! Greeter Beta Tester Tipworthy Concierge Lifegiver Person of Interest

Re: Nihilism

Tips: 0.00 INK Postby VindicatedPurpose on Fri May 13, 2022 7:51 pm

Do we need to know all true things to know enough? It doesn't seem that we need to memorize the lot of it to be able to say quite a lot about it. Indeed, we can use a small handful to derive complex logical systems that we can then use to analyze the truth-values of countless logical statements. It looks explosive.


The problem I have with this, as I've encountered over the past few years, is that logic falls short.

Have you perchance heard of postmodernism?
Like a stranger on a grate, or a skylark, or a taper, flying ever upward and knowing of love's satiety. Our dreams beyond the Sun and into the expanse of Night doth sound a quiet hymn.

Tip jar: the author of this post has received 0.00 INK in return for their work.

User avatar
VindicatedPurpose
Member for 13 years
Contributor Promethean Author Conversation Starter Inspiration World Builder Conversationalist Novelist Completionist Arc Warden Party Starter Beta Tester Greeter Visual Appeal Lifegiver Tipworthy Concierge

Re: Nihilism

Tips: 0.00 INK Postby dealing with it on Thu May 19, 2022 5:04 pm

VindicatedPurpose,
What feature about postmodernism are you referring to?

Tip jar: the author of this post has received 0.00 INK in return for their work.

User avatar
dealing with it
Groundskeeper
Groundskeeper
Member for 13 years
Contributor Conversation Starter Author Conversationalist Friendly Beginnings Donated! Greeter Beta Tester Tipworthy Concierge Lifegiver Person of Interest

Re: Nihilism

Tips: 0.00 INK Postby VindicatedPurpose on Thu Jun 23, 2022 10:15 pm

The feature of the postmodern condition that suggests that reality is subjective and made up by our perceptions, which in itself sprouted out of modernist ideas about reality and existence.

That we can't really ever know the truth, that it is removed from us.

Tip jar: the author of this post has received 0.00 INK in return for their work.

User avatar
VindicatedPurpose
Member for 13 years
Contributor Promethean Author Conversation Starter Inspiration World Builder Conversationalist Novelist Completionist Arc Warden Party Starter Beta Tester Greeter Visual Appeal Lifegiver Tipworthy Concierge


Post a reply

Make a Donation

$

RPG relies exclusively on user donations to support the platform.

Donors earn the "Contributor" achievement and are permanently recognized in the credits. Consider donating today!

 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests