World Building vs. Plot Weaving

[Ceur'Caelesetos]

I have always been great at making interesting worlds, be it fantasy, sci-fi, modern, or historical. In fact I have a gigantic Universe with a long timeline in my head. (I clocked it at an hour to thoroughly explain the whole of the timeline seeing as it covers from modern day to several thousand years in the future and involves interstellar travel.)

However I found that I'm quite terrible at creating story lines for characters to go through inside of these imaginary realms. I guess my mind can't handle the amount of detailing it takes to do such a thing.

I was wondering if anyone else is the same way or perhaps the opposite.

If so how do you conquer these problems?

(If this has already been talked about please just shoot me a link, thanks.)

[Sench]

This is a very interesting problem, indeed. I, too, suffer greatly from it, although in a slightly different fashion. I have not actually tried my hand at creating any world except a fantasy one from scratch, but I have tried to "expand" on existing worlds (including real world) in various ways.

I had no trouble coming up with the universe and setting for my original world, meaning laws of nature, nations, cultures, that sort of thing, and I had no trouble coming up with important characters and story lines for them. What I find myself practically unable to do, however, is tying everything into a comprehensive timeline. I have key characters and key events, both related and unrelated to said characters, and I have the chronological order of said events. But I can't seem to place them in the timeline, however, and create proper connections where needed.

And yeah, I know it sounds strange.

[Tea]

I was wondering if anyone else is the same way or perhaps the opposite.

If so how do you conquer these problems?

"Practice.

"Practice; practice; practice."

This is usually not the answer that we like to hear, but it is the answer we need. I believe that I once held a similar position to what was described in the first post. However, with practice, I became better. It was the daily kind of practice, but because I thought the exercises were fun I was not heavy with stress or doubt. I have found that the same techniques which treat and relieve Writer's Block also relieve the difficulty identified in the first post. That has been my experience through the description of it is quite brief in comparison to the amount of time that was required to earn it.

At the very worst a fill-in-the-blank style of inspiration might provide some assistance. Simply write down the names of all the characters. Then write down an equal number of verbs, places, and problems. Jumble them up and then draw them out at random. Once the blank spaces are filled in by the random words used there should be something, either stark or strange enough, to make one's brain think.

[LSunday]

It also can help to partner up with a friend, or fellow writer (maybe even someone else on the forum) who you think is good at it. You don't need to do a student/teacher thing, but maybe ask them to try to help you construct a story, and create a world, cast, and situation together.

I suffer from the opposite problem, which in some ways is easier to deal with. I can think of endless ways to send characters through the ringer, but if I try to stray from present-day Earth, it gets messy. However, it is easier to come up with an interesting story in a pre-existing world. The same method doesn't quite work the other way around.

[Shanatos]

The root of any storyline is conflict.

If you have a detailed world and characters, you have all the ingredients you need.

If a character is fully fleshed out, they will have at least one goal. Their road to achieving this goal is the storyline. From there, all you need is obstacles. (technically, you don't need obstacles, it's just those are what create the dramatic tension to make the story more engaging).

Now, if you are picky like me, and can't decide what angle to follow, that's another problem entirely. My recommendation is just to pick one and work at it. But, don't be afraid to try the slice-of-life angle, either. No one can go through day after day with nothing happening, so if you come with a journal for a character or two, eventually you'll start seeing opportunities to introduce a conflict.

[Ceur'Caelesetos]

My problem is the worlds I build are very grand in scale so it's tough to think of a single character going through these wars and etc.

[Shanatos]

My problem is the worlds I build are very grand in scale so it's tough to think of a single character going through these wars and etc.

So have a bunch of characters. See: A Song of Ice and Fire, Malazan Book of the Fallen.

It's completely viable (if a bit overwhelming for readers) to create multiple plot threads following different groups.

Also consider this: The real world is grand in scale, and it's pretty easy to find a single person and follow their POV. You're doing it yourself right now.

[CortexiphanGirl]

Very interesting question. It might be cool if you teamed up with a mentor and maybe did some type of guide or workshop about it - I know I'd attend!

[Kestrel]

How a world comes to be itself is a storyline. Your world has a history, I bet. Your fantasy worlds will have legends and your sci-fi worlds logs of previous wars. I mean, you can't have a complete world without them... Or at least you wouldn't have any human culture in that world. So use these stories; instant plot. You don't have to follow a single character. In fact, given we're not on a novel-writing forum but on a roleplaying forum you don't want to focus on a single character in the first place. As a GM, it is entirely plausible not to use a character of your own in the first place. Give the situation, name the factions; go! If your worlds are indeed strong, this should pose absolutely no problem to you. You see, a world consists out of relationships and organisations. The only real thing you need to add to have a plot is a conflict.

[they-go]

I have an obsession with creating worlds myself, and just writing in general. I often find it easier to write fanfictiondesires as everything is rather structured already, that's why I like to go into so much details with new worlds, because then I can just pretend someone else wrote it, and I'm writing the fan fiction. Haha

[Entity of Sin]

"You can't have your cake and eat it too." type of expression doesn't work here with world building and plot weaving. You can have both in the same roleplay. In fact, I think it would be best to try and accomplish that. Makes a story look and feel more alive.

Just throwing that out there. :)

[Marionette]

I, too, am much more given to worldbuilding than I am plotting, but you should regard your strength in worldbuilding as just that - a strength. Depending upon what your goal for the RP is, it may be sufficient, but in that case you'll want a dedicated group ready to advance the story and craft plots of their own on a regular basis. I've had this before - it's awesome to see a bunch of players take the detailed world you've given them and just run with it for fifty pages even with no real predetermined plot. It's kind of a rarity in my experience, though. Not everyone is going to be able to do that, and it's not something that should be expected of them, either. Most RPs will benefit from GM-forged direction. Still, giving your players a solid background in the world can be step one, in my eyes. They'll have a framework to inspire them and work off of, and that will help them work your plot as well as their own when they're inclined.

A lot of good has been said here already. I agree with Tea that some of the things you can do to help general writer's block can be useful here. You could freewrite, do brainstorming exercises, try writing prompts, and so forth. The goal is to get a lot of ideas on paper. Then, you can throw out (or at last put away for later) everything you don't need, picking out only the things you think will work. I would add that making use of the unexpected can be helpful. Once you have your basic plot ideas down, shake them up and see what's rolling around inside. This is where exercises and brainstorming can come in handy again. Just take something (and if you're stuck as to what, there are a number of places to get writing prompts and random twists online) and throw it into your idea, play with it, and see what happens - you might surprise yourself. If it doesn't work, you can toss it out with no harm done, but it just might give you something to build on.

LSunday's advice about partnering is also good if it's your style. I love working with others from the ground up; the mixture of ideas and perspectives can really help plotting along. If you can't think of something, someone else might.

Shanatos's emphasis on conflict and goals is something to pay close attention to. These incredibly important in general writing, but I feel that they become even more important in roleplay because of the collaborative nature. Everyone is advancing the story in part; they need things to work off of. If no conflict is presented, the game can stagnate. If everyone is standing around with no motivation, the game can stagnate. Try to present opportunities for conflict within your plot, and try to give characters things to want, reasons to want them.

Another thing you can do is work off of archetypes. It has often been said that there are really only a few different types of plot, though exactly how many gets divided differently (you can see a few different systems here, and I'll provide another link on the "36 plots"). Whether you agree with this or not, they definitely present a good place to mine for frameworks and inspiration. This is a really good look at what the "36 plots" are and how they can be used in RP. And here is a really cool list of plot types that the author created based on lots of published adventures for various tabletop RPG systems (fear not, they work with plotting freeform games equally well). The key with these is not to rehash a cliche but to look at these frameworks and figure out how they can interact with your setting, your characters, and your players' characters - how you can use them to tell an interesting story with everything you have to work with. Don't think you have to stick to just one, either, or follow them exactly. Pick and choose whatever you think works. It can also be helpful to think in terms of story arcs since your game is going to be continuing on - you can take one big plot and try to think of lots of little situations to help advance it. Additionally, always remember to leave wiggle room. You want to stick to plots that your players can work with, and you don't want to railroad them.

[Alphadean]

Ok guys here is my two cents:
1. Remember that roleplaying is interactive story telling. Its fine to build the world especially in broad strokes. No matter the game, your PC are the focal point regardless of the antoagonist goals. I purposefully have all my PC write a detailed background, that we flesh out more and more... I use these stories as the background fodder for a lot of my plotting. This way your players are vested in the game and it makes your life easier as GM.

2. Remember that roleplaying is interactive story telling. Make sure your PC's want, need, and desire to be apart of your world. By doing this the PC will give major feed back on what type of stories to tell.

3. Remember that roleplaying is interactive story telling. Is your world going to pervasive. In other words is your fantasy world the same world as your fantasy world as is you sci-fi world... Can your PC's connect the dots with characters from other genre games you've run or will run.

4. Remeber that roleplaying is interactive story telling. Have fun, make sure that from the beginning its about fun. Make sure all you players realize this too. Explain to them what it is you want to do, what the broad strokes (i.e. high adventure, exploration, good vs. evil ect.) of your world is about and they will help you flesh out your tale.

There might be more to say but I can't say there is. If you need me to elaborate more feel free to drop me a line.